http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070710/ap_on_re_eu/pope_other_christians
I don't hate Catholics. My husband and mom and in-laws are Catholic. I used to be Catholic till I heard the Gospel and got saved. I dont believe it's right that other born again Christians bash the Catholic Church either. It makes their testimony look horrible to the outside world and it makes is Christians look bad.
This article makes me heavy hearted in more ways than one. I won't go into all the errors the Pope says in this article but I will say that the One true Church is us body of believers here on this Earth. It's not a denomination or building. It's us...the followers who answered the calling of God to follow Him.
I will say this, Catholic or not...we need to open the Bible for ourselves and read and study what God has said, not man. We need to line up the Scriptures to what we are being taught. If it's not in the Scriptures, why are you obeying it? Look at the traditions that's practiced in your church service and look at the Bible. Is it Scriptural? The Bible is our road map for this life. We need to guard it with our lives. We should always be ready to give an answer for our faith.
Time to put away the best seller for the month of July...the romance novel..the comic book...the magazine..and start digging in the Word. It's our key to spiritual survival.
Bless you my wonderful bloggers! <><
Tuesday, July 10, 2007
I was having a good day till I read this...ugh...
Posted by Dawn at 10:27 AM
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22 comments:
Hey, I put up a link to your post here, as it is timely and relevent to the hurdle I seem to be jumping right now. Thanks!
I often wonder: can't we all just get along without worrying about who is the "real" church??? **Sigh**
I saw this article, too, and was saddened by it. My parents and two of my sisters are Catholic. My other sister and I are Protestant. Our parents feel that they failed somewhere along the way because we aren't Catholic anymore.
I agree with everything you stated - we need to read our Bibles ourselves and judge our churches based on God's Word - not tradition.
Writing of the bible as you do, as if it represents the only true code for living and contains the words of the only true god, is similar to the way the Pope speaks of catholisism as "the only true path to salvation". If assigns no value to other religious or spiritual paths.
Well Denise, Jesus states in the Bible that He is the way, the Truth, and the Life. Not Allah, Buddah, Mary, the Pope, a goddess, but Christ alone.
If you don't think the Bible is the answer than what do you base your faith on?
P.S. The Bible does tell us the way to live. What is a Christian supposed to follow of not the Bible? The government who has long ago kicked God out of everywhere? The humanists? The secularists? The feminists? You can if you want, but Jesus got a hold of my life and He won't let me go. His Word is true and will endure forever, regardless of what man does or says.
Hallelujah!
Thanks for the ideas (and the compliment!) Dawn!! I'm actually planning on opening up a webstore in the next year or so for the purpose of selling things we make here. When I do, I plan on also selling on ebay and etsy as well.
Hugs & Blessings!
Susan
Just happened upon your blog here and this post caught my eye.
What is your definition of "bashing"? I have several cathoilc acquaintances that think I am bashing them every time I mention Jesus. But if I do not tell them the Truth, who will? Am I to let them go on in darkness? Or am I to tell them that JESUS is The Way, The Truth and The Life?
I think it is more loving to point someone in the right direction than it is to let them continue wander aimlessly.
His,
Mrs. U
Dawn,
I've read this yesterday and was puzzled. I agree with Michelle - why can't we all get along?
Catholic bashing, at least what I consider it is when Christians right off the bat start telling Catholics that they aren't saved, that the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon, that they pray to Mary, etc. And they do it on such an ugly tone, know what I mean?
Like you said, we need to lovingly share the Bible with them, not point out all the wrong doings.
I know most Catholics are hard headed and won't listen, including my husband...ugh...he's the worst...LOL. He has alot of Old Testament knowledge and Catholic knowledge, but when I start talking about different Scriptures he keeps telling me I am judging him when all I am doing is showing him what God's word says. He's not the first Catholic who called me judgemental.
Sometimes the truth hurts. Us humans are so pridefull to admit when we are wrong. I know I did before I got saved.
Thank you for visiting Mrs.U.
God Bless your day today!
I agree Anna..what I don't understand is why, why...why..don't the Catholics take the Bible at face value? My husband makes fun of me because I am Sola Scriptura, but that's fine. I don't need another man's opinion on how to serve God, it's all right there in the Word. The Bible is not hard to read. People should have a dictionary nearby if a word confuses them, know what I mean?
I love my Catholic brothers and sisters in the Lord, I really do, my heart just yearns for them to really seek the truth out on their own without man saying "I say we believe this way, so you will listen to me".
I agree with you and Michelle...we all need to get along. Especially in this time we are living in.
Bless U!
Ok, THIS is going to be long! Please bear with me - I'll make it as short as I can!! (Sorry in advance for the length!)
I think I can best explain why Catholics "don't take the bible at face value." It has to do with this thing called, "The Spirit of Vatican II" that hit the Catholic Church in the 1960's. The 60's was an era of absolute rebellion - as we all know! - and this rebellion, this throwing off of authority and this resistance to anything that could be called an "establishment" didn't stop at the gates of the Catholic Church!! Satan had his claws in every corner of our culture with the sexual revolution and other cultural revolutions of the 1960's. It infected the Church just as much as it infected everything else from the sacredness of sex, the evil of abortion to the nobility of housewives!!! Satan was working HARD. Femminisim and feminists were the KEY destructive force in the events that plagued the Catholic Church for the past 40 years.
Keep in mind though that all along, all during these past 40 years, there were PLENTY of Catholics who did *not* fall into this shamefull nonsense. But they were effectivly silenced: the squeaky wheel gets the grease!!
Ok, I won't go any further into that or this comment will be 1 mile long. Carrying on:
A LOT of Catholics stopped learning about Jesus. Either they personally got lazy and slacked off *or* they ended up in really crappy sunday school classes. I'm talking like, instead of learning about heaven and hell they learned all sorts of that "feelings" psyco-babble that took off like wild fire in from the 1960's right up until just recently.
To speed things up I'll continue: Feminists rapidly seized control of VERY important aspects of the Catholic Church's sunday services, which we call "liturgy." They totally dumbed down the music, took away the sacredness, (You know: instead of adoring our creator GOD it was, "Jesus is our buddy! Let's hold His hand and sing Kum-by-yah!") stopped all mentions of hell and sin and tried their hardest to make the Catholic Church teach wishy-washy nonsense instead of THE GOSPLE!! They brought in Zen meditation and feminist stuff and made it so that even old Catholics could not recognize the faith!!!!
Ok, now you can imagine what kind of "learning" was going on in the colleges that trained Priests!!! The same watered-down nonsense. And worse, any man that was a serious and commited Christian was kicked OUT of the colleges and labled as having "Mental Problems." Again, Satan was working hard. So many of the Priests that hit the scene were disgustingly femminized and liberal and totally ignorant of JESUS CHRIST - and the bible!
During this same time theistic evolution was accepted by Catholic theologians. This cast all sorts of doubts on the book of Genesis!
Alright, now the bible: The Bible underwent some of the WORST attacks of all! (Satan knows what he is doing...) All sorts of totally STUPID and self-serving "scholars" came out of the woodwork and began to reduce the bible to nothing. They'd say of every single book, "Oh well, we don't know WHO wrote this book or WHEN it was written ..." *EVEN THOUGH* we have known all along for 2,000 years!! Also, these idiotic "scholars" would totally dumb down the scriptures and they turned EVERYTHING into just "myth" or "fable" or a "fictional story used to pass on a moral truth." What happened? Well, the bible became totally useless. It lost ALL authority and no one trusted it. Who would take the bible at face value any more??
Ladies, by the time all of these forces were done totally messing everything up we ended up with about three generations of totally ignorant Catholics. They knew nothing of the faith and nothing of the bible!! What they did "know" was usually a bunch of rubbish. People fell away from faith in Jesus by DROVES! (Why wouldn't they?) and it looked like Satan had won...
But now everything is swinging back to normal because the femmenists are getting old and starting to lose their power! Those Catholics who have always remained faithful to Jesus AND the younger generations of Catholics are no longer tolerating this NONSENSE. Also, Pope Benedict is taking the Church by the reins and swinging everything *away* from the rebellion and feminism of the 1960's and back to sanity.
Catholics are now getting back into the Bible - and they are also tossing away their wishy-washy bible translations!!
It's still going to take time to repair all of the damage. But I have been a Catholic for 9 years and in just 9 years I have seen HUGE changes taking place! Soon Catholics will return to what they were before: well-taught and bible loving Christians who reject the stupid "scholars". Satan is losing his grip.
Obviously this is an over-simplified explanation for the sake of length!!!
P.S. "Vatican II" is short for "The Second Vatican Council" where the then-Pope instituted some reforms. The lay-people took advantage of these reforms and did what THEY wanted to do rather then what the documents acctually said. For example, nuns were told that they could modify their habits because they no longer lived in damp stone houses - and so they no longer had to wear heavy wool etc. Thousands of nuns, infected with the 60's spirit of rebellion, totally got rid of the habit! People totally ABUSED the Second Vatican Council for their own agendas.
Hi - I've been reading for a few days, but I don't think I've commented.
I think that "Catholic bashing" is when you use only anti-Catholic literature to make a point. I find it much more effective to use Catholic literature against Scripture.
Another example is using half-truth or flat-out falsehoods (this comes from only reading Protestant anti-Catholic literature instead of going to the source.
You can present truth, you can present "Truth" and you can point out the difference between what Rome is truly teaching (truth) and what the Bible truly teaches (Truth). If you only present what is real (truly taught), you don't have to cover yourself later and you make more of an impact if you're credible!
blessings...
Michelle...you rock my Sister! *high 5* I love your zealousness!
I don't doubt for one moment that you are not saved. I know you are and I know you fully trust in Jesus as your Saviour.
The Catholic Church needs more people like you...who are sick and tired of the wishy washy luke warm pat yourself on the back for going to church type stuff, and who desire the meat of God's Holy Word.
Girl you got me fired up now..I'm about to have a Hallelujah breakdown...LOL.
I wish more nuns would wear their habits. They are so beautiful with them on. You can't even tell who is a 'sister' except for the name tag they wear now. :(
Here in Germany while at the train station earlier this year I saw a nun in her full habit. I think her dress / skirt was gray and her headcovering black. So pretty...
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Hi Ellen..glad you came on to say hello! Have a blessed day!!!
Hugs to all!
One of the places I go on a regular basis is a Franciscan abbey. The sisters are self-sufficient (it's a farm, they grow and sell food and even have a wind-mill so their electricity is "made" on site.)
You just haven't lived until you see a Sister driving a tractor in full habit - and a plaid work jacket and black farm boots.
I know these women and I would never make a blanket statement about their salvation, based on their inclusion in the Roman Catholic church
;-)
I guess I don't see what the big deal about this article is. So the Catholic Church thinks that they are the one true Church, and that other churches fall short. Doesn't every church believe that about itself?
The Catholic Church didn't say that other Christians couldn't attain salvation, just that they didn't have the full revelation of what Jesus intended the church to look like. This is more generous so far than many fundamentalists, such as Candy Brauer, who do not believe that Catholics can attain salvation.
If you're the sort of person (and I'm not saying YOU are, Dawn Marie) who thinks Catholics are wrong, and going to hell, then what does it matter if they think you are wrong too?
As far as the Biblical basis for Catholicism, I suggest stopping by http://www.scripturecatholic.com/. You will disagree with their interpretations, but Catholics believe that their theology IS based on scripture.
Finally, contrary to what Candy posted a day or two ago, the Catholic Church states in their catechism that we are saved by God's grace, through our faith, which is manifest in our works. There is surely plenty of other points to criticize, without mischaracterizing their theology.
Ellen,
I would love to go to that Fransician Abbey. I think it's great that they pretty much live 'off the grid'. That's what me and my husband want to do. Be fully self sufficiant. It can be done, it cost money and work, but I think in the long run, it's worth it. :)
Nuns on tractors in full garb...that's awesome! See...all these women that say they can't do this or that in a dress...these nuns are proof that you can :) It's good to know there are nuns out there who still wear the habits. Praise God for that!
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Hi Kelly,
You are right...other churches believe they are the one true church as well, I have heard that before, but it's not like the Pope has it where it's etched in stone. But either way I don't think Christians are going to care.
I have read Candy's blog. She's a sweet lady. :)
I do believe with all my heart that their are saved Catholics and they are Heavenbound just like the rest of the born again Christians. We all have a choice...live and serve God or live and serve the father of this world.
God can save anybody, in any church. Doesn't matter the denomination.
I used to be Catholic but never heard the Gospel preached. In fact, I don't remember much of anything I was ever taught in CCD / confirmation classes, and even though I left the church at 16...I didn't leave God. I was hungry..searching for the truth, for answers. In 2001 someone invited me out to a full gospel church and I finally heard it. I have never looked back.
I have grown so much since I got saved and learned so much that sometimes I just wanna burst to share it with someone.
I have seen a few Catholics that have borne much fruit and it's a true blessing to see that. I hope they continue on for the Lord.
I have read alot about Catholic theology...my husband is Catholic and I have read the apologetics books and Cathechism, but I also had my Bible with me as I was reading them, and things just weren't clicking.
Thank you for suggesting that website though.
Many blessings sent your way!
Perhaps if everyone actually read the document! As per usual, the media spun it their own way.
There's a copy on My blog
My apologies, I hit the send button too soon.
Two more points Dawn Marie
God can save anybody, in any church. Doesn't matter the denomination.
If you actually read the document, it pretty much says that!
I have seen a few Catholics that have borne much fruit and it's a true blessing to see that. I hope they continue on for the Lord.
You might be very interested in reading these Catholic ladies' blogs.
Hello Dawn Marie,
I've been reading Blogs and came across yours. I see you are a headcovering plain living person who has a spouse in the military.
I too am a military wife US Navy 17 years in the submarine force.
Also a new Christian myself.
We were a headcovering family until about 6 months ago. I would love to hear about your experiences as a headcovering, plain liviing, military wife.
God Bless,
Jana
Dawn Marie,
When I first came across your blog, I was a bit trepidatious about posting and reading regularly as I am a "born again" Catholic. (Praise God!) This post, tho' originally based on a media-biaised news article, has convinced me that you are truly a sweet soul. I love how you are accepting that /your/ way is not the only way, the Christ is. One of my favorite Catholic teachings is (this is a paraphrase) "God is too big for us to define, who are we humans to limit Him and say He cannot bring souls to Him through extraordinary means." Thank you for your tolerance and understanding!
I really want to leave it at that, but I'm so being promted to pull out my Bible and quote 2 Thessalonians 2:15 "Therefore, brothers, stand firm and hold fast to the traditions that you were taught, either by an oral statement or by a letter of ours." This is using the New American Bible translation. I have found different traslations very useful for cross-referencing different passages. As you've pointed out, the OT was written in Hebrew and the NT in Greek and English can be a vague language at times, so I collect different translations and when I come across a difficult teaching or passage, I pull out a few more Bibles and see how other "scholars" decided to "spin" God's Holy Word. Some day I want to learn the Hebrew and Greek, then all I would need to do is find the Bible in the original languages! :D
God Bless!
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